Took the kids to the now completely open play area in the park yesterday. On the whole I thought it was pretty good. Certainly nice to have all new equipment. There were a couple of areas for concern though. Not least of which was the seemingly easy manner in which one older child (possibly teenager) was able to climb on the outside to the very top of the large tower and stand on it's roof. A fall from this height would, at best, result in broken bones. Now, of course it's the parents responsibility to make sure their kids aren't doing this kind of thing, but since seing the place being built I had always questioned the need for a two-storey tower, given that you can be sure that some people will not use it in the way intended.
Also a shame to see dogs off leads being allowed to wander in amongst the play equipment (which was a concern raised about the lack of surrounding fence). Many children, mine included, aren't keen on dogs, especially large ones, and it's a shame that before - when the area was fenced off - they could play without being worried by them, but now are not so eager to play there. One of the other concerns regarding the lack of surrounding fence was that it was easier for children to potentially wander off. With the boating lake and canal being relatively close this was a concern for some parents. However, I had to chuckle when I saw the quick-fix implemented to put parents minds at rest...
The new equipment is very good. I think it just needs a bit of getting used to. I also prefer the new location (among trees), as it provides extra shade and encourages picnics. It's a big shame the fence has gone
Took the kids to the now completely open play area in the park yesterday. On the whole I thought it was pretty good. Certainly nice to have all new equipment. There were a couple of areas for concern though. Not least of which was the seemingly easy manner in which one older child (possibly teenager) was able to climb on the outside to the very top of the large tower and stand on it's roof. A fall from this height would, at best, result in broken bones. Now, of course it's the parents responsibility to make sure their kids aren't doing this kind of thing, but since seing the place being built I had always questioned the need for a two-storey tower, given that you can be sure that some people will not use it in the way intended.
Also a shame to see dogs off leads being allowed to wander in amongst the play equipment (which was a concern raised about the lack of surrounding fence). Many children, mine included, aren't keen on dogs, especially large ones, and it's a shame that before - when the area was fenced off - they could play without being worried by them, but now are not so eager to play there. One of the other concerns regarding the lack of surrounding fence was that it was easier for children to potentially wander off. With the boating lake and canal being relatively close this was a concern for some parents. However, I had to chuckle when I saw the quick-fix implemented to put parents minds at rest...
This is the response from the Services Manager at Newbury Town Council with regards to the points raised above:
There is always a small minority of idiots that go one step too far. I would not agree that it is easy to climb onto the roof, but if someone is determined enough they will always find a way. The Megga Tower complies with the latest safety standards and provides a challenging and fun piece of equipment for kids to use and is extremely popular – this is the first of its type in the UK.
The play area has been designed to allow further expansion, as and when funds allow. The cost to fence the area is considerable (£38K) which would have left very little from the budget to install play equipment. We consulted with ROSPA, Sport England and Playbuilder regarding fencing the play area, they all confirmed that play areas should be left as open spaces (except for sand pits) and signage should be installed to flag up any adjacent water hazards. Dogs are difficult to police and we are having an additional sign made to request that they are kept on a lead in or around the play areas.
The new equipment is very good. I think it just needs a bit of getting used to. I also prefer the new location (among trees), as it provides extra shade and encourages picnics. It's a big shame the fence has gone
It is good to have new, clean equipment, although I was wondering if the work had been signed off yet. I noticed a couple of things that needed to be fixed. One, a relatively minor issue, was the fact that the gate to the sandpit (which does include a fence to stop animals getting in) doesn't close properly, making the whole idea of the fence surrounding it pointless, and the money spent on the fence and gate wasted.
The other thing I noticed is that there is a hanging/swinging basket which is suspended from a curved "L" shaped frame. This should be firmly secured in the base which is sunk into the ground, although the frame should flex slightly at the top.
The one in the park moves at the base as the swing goes back and forth. It does still have four bolts in place, and I would think that it is unlikely it should ever cause a safety issue but, given the amount of use it gets, it's hard to know what the wearing effect of that movement will be in a year or so's time.
I guess my point is it's nice, new equipment and paid for as such along with the installation. If there are things that aren't right, they should be made right by the company that installed it all.
Anyone know who is the best person to speak to at the council regarding this?
This is the response from the Services Manager at Newbury Town Council with regards to the points raised above:
There is always a small minority of idiots that go one step too far. I would not agree that it is easy to climb onto the roof, but if someone is determined enough they will always find a way. The Megga Tower complies with the latest safety standards and provides a challenging and fun piece of equipment for kids to use and is extremely popular – this is the first of its type in the UK.
The play area has been designed to allow further expansion, as and when funds allow. The cost to fence the area is considerable (£38K) which would have left very little from the budget to install play equipment. We consulted with ROSPA, Sport England and Playbuilder regarding fencing the play area, they all confirmed that play areas should be left as open spaces (except for sand pits) and signage should be installed to flag up any adjacent water hazards. Dogs are difficult to police and we are having an additional sign made to request that they are kept on a lead in or around the play areas.
Wow! That's a quick response. I understand about the reduced funding available and the restriction that places on how to handle the project. Although £38k for fencing sounds very steep. It's also interesting to hear that ROSPA, Sport England and Playbuilder supposedly told NTC not to put a fence around the site. In the literature that I've seen there hasn't been any such direct instruction. Instead, the advantages and disadvantages of fencing are listed, with no specific preference given to whether or not it should be used.
This is the response from the Services Manager at Newbury Town Council with regards to the points raised above:
We consulted with ROSPA, Sport England and Playbuilder regarding fencing the play area, they all confirmed that play areas should be left as open spaces (except for sand pits) and signage should be installed to flag up any adjacent water hazards. Dogs are difficult to police and we are having an additional sign made to request that they are kept on a lead in or around the play areas.
There's one habit that dogs have that can be annoying, and a health hazard: marking territory. So while this might not be a RoSPA issue, is it not possibly a H&S issue?
I think ladies of any age can find dogs have another unpleasant habit. As for gents, I find my knee being mounted a bit of a challenge.
It should be fenced. Maybe an electric sheep fence with a car battery. The kids would find it fun for a few times,and then get bored. Dogs would take the Pavlovian message. ce
Anyone know who is the best person to speak to at the council regarding this?
The cost of fencing is clearly caught up in the grander scheme of things. I agree that to spend £35k on a fence from a £90k budget is a little strange, but the money's rolling in every week.
NTC has received developer contributions from Travelodge and the ex-hostel in Queens Road plus others worth £9k in the last month.
But a lot gets earmarked for other things such as the £60k to convert the toilets into changing rooms (WBC still own this and want it flattened). Then there's the remedial works to the Park Way railings, the £150k to change the tennis courts into a 'multigames area', plus the £60k a year bill just to maintain the place.
But if we want a fence, and it appears that cost is the only issue, then NTC could use some of our £1.2m reserves (currently earning 0.5% interest).
I understand the play area contractors are organising a big opening event, so it might be worth a few concerned parents popping down then and asking our councillors why they can't find money for a fence if that's what the parents want.
It is good to have new, clean equipment, although I was wondering if the work had been signed off yet. I noticed a couple of things that needed to be fixed. One, a relatively minor issue, was the fact that the gate to the sandpit (which does include a fence to stop animals getting in) doesn't close properly, making the whole idea of the fence surrounding it pointless, and the money spent on the fence and gate wasted.
The other thing I noticed is that there is a hanging/swinging basket which is suspended from a curved "L" shaped frame. This should be firmly secured in the base which is sunk into the ground, although the frame should flex slightly at the top.
The one in the park moves at the base as the swing goes back and forth. It does still have four bolts in place, and I would think that it is unlikely it should ever cause a safety issue but, given the amount of use it gets, it's hard to know what the wearing effect of that movement will be in a year or so's time.
I guess my point is it's nice, new equipment and paid for as such along with the installation. If there are things that aren't right, they should be made right by the company that installed it all.
Anyone know who is the best person to speak to at the council regarding this?
Again, we have a speedy answer for you:
The company is already booked to re-tension the gate. The difficulty with gate tension springs is that they need time to bed in – if you over tension at the start there is a danger that little children could get their fingers bruised.
The cantilever swing is also due for inspection, as is the rest of the equipment – booked for Friday. We always keep a close eye on new equipment as bolts etc need re-tensioning fairly soon after the equipment has been installed.
It seems like the skate park is open for business as well. Must pop down and have a look, there were a load of youngsters on it in the pouring rain on their bikes, this evening I noticed as I went down the A339. I must say, at first glance it looks pretty good.
and thought I'd post it as a humourous observation about how it's not only our own council that can be seen to get things wrong. But then I read a sentence or two on and thought that if York Council can get a fence for £6000 why can't we? I then read another sentence on and saw that it wasn't just a plain old border fence, but rather a fence that surrounds - you've guessed it - a new play park!
Clearly York Council don't subscribe to the suposed current directive of not fencing in kid's play areas. Also, the article says that they are installing "an aerial runway, a mega-basket swing, outdoor fitness equipment, a jungle climber and web traverse/balance equipment." That's a lot of kit for £37k.
Fences are important for two reasons. Firstly they keep dogs out - incidents with dogs result in a significant number of visits to casualty departments each year. Secondly they help to secure younger children from running off while their carer's attention is distracted.
There is no legal requirement to provide a fence and where neither of the above are problems then a fence may be unnecessary.
I don't think NTC were told to not have a fence, purely advised that it is not a legal requirement.
Fences are important for two reasons. Firstly they keep dogs out - incidents with dogs result in a significant number of visits to casualty departments each year. Secondly they help to secure younger children from running off while their carer's attention is distracted.
There is no legal requirement to provide a fence and where neither of the above are problems then a fence may be unnecessary.
I don't think NTC were told to not have a fence, purely advised that it is not a legal requirement.
Exactly. Although that's not what the NTC guy said...
Quoted Text
We consulted with ROSPA, Sport England and Playbuilder regarding fencing the play area, they all confirmed that play areas should be left as open spaces (except for sand pits) and signage should be installed to flag up any adjacent water hazards.
At best, a fib. I agree with you (I know it doesn't happen often!). The most ROSPA would have done is say that it's not a legal requirement.
Purely reading the ROSPA advice, and given that dogs and water are both considerations, it's hard to see how NTC could come to the conclusion that a fence simply isn't necessary. Call me cynical, but this smacks of nothing other than cost saving. And as soon as it's confirmed that there is no legal requirement for a fence, then it's clear that none will be installed.
Exactly. Although that's not what the NTC guy said...
At best, a fib. I agree with you (I know it doesn't happen often!). The most ROSPA would have done is say that it's not a legal requirement.
Purely reading the ROSPA advice, and given that dogs and water are both considerations, it's hard to see how NTC could come to the conclusion that a fence simply isn't necessary. Call me cynical, but this smacks of nothing other than cost saving. And as soon as it's confirmed that there is no legal requirement for a fence, then it's clear that none will be installed.
Look this is Newbury we are talking about have you ever known the local authorities to get it right first time? Mess it up and it keeps them employed a bit longer to have an investigation why it went wrong, blame some poor contractor, then spend more time and taxpayers money putting it to rights and so the circle continues. Jobs for the boys?
Look this is Newbury we are talking about have you ever known the local authorities to get it right first time? Mess it up and it keeps them employed a bit longer to have an investigation why it went wrong, blame some poor contractor, then spend more time and taxpayers money putting it to rights and so the circle continues. Jobs for the boys?
In this post you seem to be agreeing with the previous poster that the council "blame some poor contractor" too much, whilst another you agree with another poster that they should take more action against contractors.
Which do you actually believe. The first one or the second one?
In this post you seem to be agreeing with the previous poster that the council "blame some poor contractor" too much, whilst another you agree with another poster that they should take more action against contractors.
Which do you actually believe. The first one or the second one?
Both statements are valid. Rather than blaming the poor contractors, we should be taking more action against them. It's about time the council toughened up it's position and started acting on the interests of the taxpayers / residents of West Berkshire.
Both statements are valid. Rather than blaming the poor contractors, we should be taking more action against them. It's about time the council toughened up it's position and started acting on the interests of the taxpayers / residents of West Berkshire.
How can they take action if they don't ask the contractors to take the blame or admit liability for the mistake?
How can they take action if they don't ask the contractors to take the blame or admit liability for the mistake?
You miss the point User; the councils publicly blame the contractors for the benefits of the press. Behind closed doors it is a differetnt story. That is why the council never seeks recompense from any contractors and the taxpayers ends up footing the bills for putting things to rights!
Incidentally, who ended up paying for the remedial work to the current Newbury Library?
and the remedial work to the block paving and who wpuld be surprised if we paid for the cracks to the park. Didn't we pay for the botched signs when the unitary councils were introduced?
Who paid for the remedial work on the Thatcham Visual Enhancement Scheme? After many complaints from residents that it hadn't been finished to a decent standard, the council STILL failed to inspect it before the period of time ran out, meaninhg we had to pay for the work to be redone.
How can they take action if they don't ask the contractors to take the blame or admit liability for the mistake?
They shouldn't be so incopetant then, should they? Turns out that they are now saying that head of legal should be consulted before contracts are signed off. WHY THE HECK WAS THIS NOT HAPPENING ALREADY??? No wonder you have such a hard job defending the shambles that is your beloved West Berkshire District Council. We need effective leadership and opposition, both corporate and politically.
Noticed the other day that the swings by the tower are missing/have been removed. They do appear to have fixed the gate to the sand pit, but the cantilever swing still rocks about in it's socket.
Popped along on Saturday with my youngest and noticed that the absence of a fence meant that the "children's" play park was mostly occupied by much older children. The lack of a fence seems a bit of a faux pas.
I'm sure that's the case. But it's hard to know how letting it all settle will help with pools of water developing when it rains. One of the largest puddles is right at the bottom of the small slide and by the entrance to the sand pit. It doesn't seem to take a lot of rain either before the puddles appear. It would be interesting to know whether this, again, is a responsibility of the contractor to make it all good, or whether their responsibility ends with the equipment itself.
Kids running off and going missing - an excuse for not doing your job as a parent.
As a parent, I am painfully aware that sometimes you only have to sneeze and a toddler goes AWOL, so generally it's not bad parenting ! However, I did remove a very small boy from the skatepark last year, and enlisted a st johns ambulance man to help me find his mother. It took quite a while to locate her, and she wasn't remotely bothered - infact the child was back on the ramps again within a few minutes !
I've not been to the new play area recently (I'm one of those bad parents who can't look after two kids at once ), but my wife took our kids there yesterday, and took a couple of shots of the lovely grass surrounding the younger kid's equipment. I remember it getting bad the last time I was there, but it's pretty grim expecting kids to play in this.
Also, this was Sunday afternoon, and the weather had been good all day, so this is rain from the day before which still hadn't drained. To me this seems like a pretty big design issue if the bottom of slides cannot drain quickly after bad weather. There is also a similar sized pond right by the entrance to the sand pit. Not great for £90,000.
You need to remember that the previous name for Victoria Park was The Marsh. The only way to drain the area would be to ask SLI to turn their pumps back on.
All of the grass area is in a mess. The skatepark builders left it in a terrible state on the north side behind the construction. Didn't even bother to level out the tracks left by the plant they used. As far as the kiddies play area is concerned, that should have been astro turfed on top of a shock absorbant matting. The job appears to have been done on the cheap and is showing the lack of design and site management. Have you seen the state of the boat pond while we are on the subject. The whole surface covered in slimy green weed/algae. No way I'd let my kids on that. The problem as I see it is that it is filled with water from the Kennet which is already contaminated with algae and with potential healthproblems carried with it As the water is static, the growth with a bit of sunlight is considerable. It would be possible to treat the water and there are safe, ecofriendly products available which if used would mean the pond doesn't need draining and cleaning every few weeks and because no weed grows in the treated water, swans and ducks do not paddle about on it, pooing and peeing in the water.
The kiddies playground was moved North to make room for the pavilion, so perhaps failing to maintain the pond will be an excuse to move that as well.
All of the grass area is in a mess. The skatepark builders left it in a terrible state on the north side behind the construction. Didn't even bother to level out the tracks left by the plant they used. As far as the kiddies play area is concerned, that should have been astro turfed on top of a shock absorbant matting. The job appears to have been done on the cheap and is showing the lack of design and site management. Have you seen the state of the boat pond while we are on the subject. The whole surface covered in slimy green weed/algae. No way I'd let my kids on that. The problem as I see it is that it is filled with water from the Kennet which is already contaminated with algae and with potential healthproblems carried with it As the water is static, the growth with a bit of sunlight is considerable. It would be possible to treat the water and there are safe, ecofriendly products available which if used would mean the pond doesn't need draining and cleaning every few weeks and because no weed grows in the treated water, swans and ducks do not paddle about on it, pooing and peeing in the water.
The kiddies playground was moved North to make room for the pavilion, so perhaps failing to maintain the pond will be an excuse to move that as well.
Yes and we ought to do away with that muddy noisy kiddies play area as no one is using it either it would be better for the PavillionUsers Pigeon Loft Councillors Wine club don't you know? What?
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