Richard will these be separate protests, where you need to decide which one to join, or one big one?

One single one, with follow up protests in the next ten days. One I can tell you about is the Unison protest which is happening at 6 / 6:30pm on Thursday 9th December. It's not a Labour Party event, but as they are protesting against the closure of the five day centres, I'd like to think a decent number of our members will attend.

Can you post organiser details of this please, or PM me?

Unison at WBC Market Street office are doing the one on the ninth, can't remember the number off the top of my head but ring the council main number and ask for the unison office.

OK, I wrote a post last night and then removed it as it was supposed to be kept quiet!!! There was a protest this afternoon in Newbury Town Centre, over 100 people turning out according to the NWN to protest against tuition fees, EMA and cuts to day centres. All the students were well behaved, and was nice to see a couple of people from other parties there too. (No Tories there - obviously)

A secret protest ???

Apparently only 40 people turned up

http://www.facebook.com/?ref=logo#!/event.php?eid=109968362406940

and some of them were only to there see what was going on. What a failure.

NWN were at the start of the protest, and they also report over 100. 60 people also occupied WBC's Market Street offices for 45 minutes. All peacefull, and quite fun too. It wasn't secret, just not to be publicied to the media so there was an element of surprise. I'd say with the cold weather, snow and a little rain, over 100 people in the Market Street was a fairly good turnout. Only 300 said they would attend, 1 in 3 turn out isn't bad I'd say?

http://www.newburytoday.co.uk/News/Article.aspx?articleID=15249

http://www.heart.co.uk/berkshire/local/news/protesters-enter-county-hall/

http://newburysound.co.uk/students-protest-in-newbury-i-7909.php

Newbury Weekly News were there from the start, Newbury Sound arrived at 4:45 or so, after the paper had left, so maybe some people had left by then? I know the union members didn't attend Market Street as they have a protest planned there next week. Always so negative User23.

Quoted from richard.garvie

http://www.newburytoday.co.uk/News/Article.aspx?articleID=15249

http://www.heart.co.uk/berkshire/local/news/protesters-enter-county-hall/

http://newburysound.co.uk/students-protest-in-newbury-i-7909.php

Newbury Weekly News were there from the start, Newbury Sound arrived at 4:45 or so, after the paper had left, so maybe some people had left by then? I know the union members didn't attend Market Street as they have a protest planned there next week. Always so negative User23.

Sounds like there were more reporters than protesters.

You would have seen that was not the case. Nice to see the whole building stopped working to come and take a look!!!

Quoted from richard.garvie

You would have seen that was not the case. Nice to see the whole building stopped working to come and take a look!!!

I didn't see anything of the protests Richard, I'm just going on what's been reported, 40 people it says on the Facebook group.

It's not the way to get the public on side though, stopping them from accessing public services by staging a sit in in support of a mix-and-match protest about council staff free parking amongst other things.

I will help organise the next one. This isn't about party politics anyway, there were people from other parties there too.

Quoted from richard.garvie

NWN were at the start of the protest, and they also report over 100. 60 people also occupied WBC's Market Street offices for 45 minutes. All peacefull, and quite fun too. It wasn't secret, just not to be publicied to the media so there was an element of surprise. I'd say with the cold weather, snow and a little rain, over 100 people in the Market Street was a fairly good turnout. Only 300 said they would attend, 1 in 3 turn out isn't bad I'd say?

I would have thought that the best way to draw attention to the cause would have been to use the media ?

Quoted from PaulaM

I would have thought that the best way to draw attention to the cause would have been to use the media ?

I would have thought this it too. I suspect they knew about it though, as it was the worst kept secret in Newbury.

I don't know, I wasn't that involved. I'll help out with the next one though, and I hope there will be more people there on the day.

http://www.facebook.com/pages/.....3597429&view=all

Some pics taken by Unison whilst waiting for people to arrive.

An embarrassingly low turnout pictured there, and you're all alone talking to yourself on the wall of the group.

http://www.facebook.com/pages/.....4254713597429?v=info

That's the new page.

Quoted from user23.3

An embarrassingly low turnout pictured there, and you're all alone talking to yourself on the wall of the group.

http://www.facebook.com/pages/.....4254713597429?v=info

You're all alone here mate.

And the irony of a public servant laughing at those protesting cuts in public service. Does your arse licking know no limits?

I wonder if he will be standing outside the council offices next Thursday in solidarity with his colleagues?

Quoted from 26

And the irony of a public servant laughing at those protesting cuts in public service. Does your arse licking know no limits?

The name of the group in the link is "West Berks against tuition fees". Tuition fees are hardly a public service, are they?

Then there's Richard posting "Anyone got any pics?", and replying to himself over and over again, in fact the last seven posts have been from him on the wall.

The trouble with protests is there are usually prats (am I allowed to say that ?) who turn up to do nothing but trash the place. Having seen some of the students in London behave like complete arses, I am thankful I am not contributing to their higher education - the only thing they deserve from me is a clip round the ear  

Incidentally, I paid for my own further education, and gained a degree (or two), I am not from an affluent background - I simply got off my arse and worked very hard doing allsorts of cleaning and bar jobs.

Quoted from PaulaM

The trouble with protests is there are usually prats (am I allowed to say that ?) who turn up to do nothing but trash the place. Having seen some of the students in London behave like complete arses, I am thankful I am not contributing to their higher education - the only thing they deserve from me is a clip round the ear  

Incidentally, I paid for my own further education, and gained a degree (or two), I am not from an affluent background - I simply got off my arse and worked very hard doing allsorts of cleaning and bar jobs.

There were no 'prats' that I witnessed in Newbury yesterday, quite the contrary.  The whole thing was done with good humour and I think the students of Newbury conducted themselves well.  I wasn't in all areas, so could you say where you saw people 'behave like complete arses'?

BTW, the only free education is if you live in Scotland.

Quoted from jay

There were no 'prats' that I witnessed in Newbury yesterday, quite the contrary.  The whole thing was done with good humour and I think the students of Newbury conducted themselves well.  I wasn't in all areas, so could you say where you saw people 'behave like complete arses'?

BTW, the only free education is if you live in Scotland.

I think if you RE-READ my post you will see EXACTLY where I saw some students behaved like arses ........... I could of course add many other towns/cities to the list, thankfully Newbury was not one of them, maybe thats because it was a low key "secret" protest.

A peaceful protest is rarely profitable, but one thing to understand, there is no such thing as free.

It wasn't quite secret, but it wasn't publicised to the press to cause an element of surprise. I think the point was well made, and there will be another student protest next week and a Union protest also. For me the message is very clear, students want Benyon to vote against the increase in fees and unions and young people want the council to save money from over sources instead of hitting frontline services.

The devil is in the detail regarding fees, the increase is to pay for the 80% reduction in central government funding to universities.

Quoted from richard.garvie

The devil is in the detail regarding fees, the increase is to pay for the 80% reduction in central government funding to universities.

We have in fact been hoisted by our own petard in that governments reduced the quality of student entry in order to make their unemployment figures look better. Now they can't afford to maintain the large number of red brick universities that were upgraded from further education facilities and which accept students with dubious A levels to swell their student numbers.

The current government whoever they really are, are attempting to reverse the trend by making the university charge the going rate. This will increase the out of work job totals as potential students realise they have to get jobs on the value of their degree to future employers to finance the debt. As this will take place over a few years then government will, by then, have some other scheme going and can blame the other party for the results.

I just think that we need a bit of honesty in politics, locally and nationally. There is some truth in what you say Brian, but there is not enough vacancies out there to pick up the slack of would be students and the people that are losing their benefit plus all of the public sector workers and the private sector workers who lose their jobs as a result of knock on effects.

Quoted from user23.3

The name of the group in the link is "West Berks against tuition fees". Tuition fees are hardly a public service, are they?

Last time I looked education was a public service. I'm quite certain that regular users here must see that those that work at WBC are totally self serving. A disgrace and the reason this country is in a mess. Let's hope the tories hold firm against you.

I have to say, the council staff I saw at the protest were very polite and sympathetic. I think most of the council staff who are part of Unison will protest outside the council offices next week, and I wish I could be there to support them. A group of four or five people stayed behind to tidy up on Tuesday because it's not the council staff who are the target of these protests, and the protest next Wednesday will be kept away from Market Street, instead focussing on the Tories and Richard Benyon.

If User23 has any class, he will be protesting with Unison next Thursday like a lot of his colleagues. Cuts and savings will have to be made, but they have to be made with a bit of thought and a bit of common sence. Cutting key services is not the way to do it.

The way the on-line questionnaire is worded, it seems that all council services are key, so what should be cut as an alternative to the current proposal?

What I don't get is the obsession with personal budgets. Is it not true that this is going to cost more in the way of payments, and more in the way of administration? It's not as simple as taking 10% off a certain department, what needs to happen is a thorough review of what the council does and what we see it doing in future.The Budget Simulator is totally misleading, as you can't actually make the decisions such as the amount of money we spend on parking, or protect the amount of money on a specific service you want to keep. If you take ten percent of adult social care, how do you know the council won't then close the other four day centres?

[quote=190]The trouble with protests is there are usually prats (am I allowed to say that ?) who turn up to do nothing but trash the place. Having seen some of the students in London behave like complete arses, I am thankful I am not contributing to their higher education - the only thing they deserve from me is a clip round the ear  
quote]

Was you actually at London and saw what happened, or are you basing your opinion on television reportage ?

Quoted from richard.garvie

What I don't get is the obsession with personal budgets. Is it not true that this is going to cost more in the way of payments, and more in the way of administration? It's not as simple as taking 10% off a certain department, what needs to happen is a thorough review of what the council does and what we see it doing in future.The Budget Simulator is totally misleading, as you can't actually make the decisions such as the amount of money we spend on parking, or protect the amount of money on a specific service you want to keep. If you take ten percent of adult social care, how do you know the council won't then close the other four day centres?

This is quote from the Mail on Tuesday 'Tens of thousands of state jobs will be spared the axe thanks to benefit cuts and reductions in public sector pensions.' [George Osborne] 'the reduction in job losses... resulted from the action we have taken to cut welfare bills rather than public services'.  Also we will have to pay £19Billion less than first thought as borrowing costs have fallen.  We therefore have far more money in the pot than we thought and Newbury will get its fair share.  For Newbury does this mean we will lose less people from the Council, but frontline services, such as the five day care homes will still be cut?

Big cuts and savings will still be required at West Berks. The original estimate was £33,320,000 over four years that would need to be saved.

Quoted from richard.garvie

What I don't get is the obsession with personal budgets. Is it not true that this is going to cost more in the way of payments, and more in the way of administration? It's not as simple as taking 10% off a certain department, what needs to happen is a thorough review of what the council does and what we see it doing in future.The Budget Simulator is totally misleading, as you can't actually make the decisions such as the amount of money we spend on parking, or protect the amount of money on a specific service you want to keep. If you take ten percent of adult social care, how do you know the council won't then close the other four day centres?

This is quote from the Mail on Tuesday 'Tens of thousands of state jobs will be spared the axe thanks to benefit cuts and reductions in public sector pensions.' [George Osborne] 'the reduction in job losses... resulted from the action we have taken to cut welfare bills rather than public services'.  Also we will have to pay £19Billion less than first thought as borrowing costs have fallen.  We therefore have far more money in the pot than we thought and Newbury will get its fair share.  For Newbury does this mean we will lose less people from the Council, but frontline services, such as the five day care homes will still be cut?

The centres should not be cut regardless of what our grant from central government is. We need to look elsewhere in my opinion, but it's the easy option for Graham Jones as there are some issues surrounding these centres if they were to remain open.

Quoted from richard.garvie

If User23 has any class, he will be protesting with Unison next Thursday like a lot of his colleagues. Cuts and savings will have to be made, but they have to be made with a bit of thought and a bit of common sence. Cutting key services is not the way to do it.

Perhaps he realises that WBC waste a lot of money so there is nothing to protest about!

Quoted from 26

Last time I looked education was a public service. I'm quite certain that regular users here must see that those that work at WBC are totally self serving. A disgrace and the reason this country is in a mess. Let's hope the tories hold firm against you.

This is a new one, WBC is a disgrace and the reason this country is in a mess?

I don't even see what they've got to do with university tuition fees myself let alone why the county is in a mess.

I've seen some amusing rants on here in my time on here but this a tops them all.

User23 - Where would you make savings of £33,320,000?

Quoted from user23.3

This is a new one, WBC is a disgrace and the reason this country is in a mess?

I don't even see what they've got to do with university tuition fees myself let alone why the county is in a mess.

I've seen some amusing rants on here in my time on here but this a tops them all.

Well they wasted £26m on a new school. So there you have education and overspend. But apparently WBC have nothing to do with either of these things. They just provide hot meals for little old ladies.

The money for the new school came from the school building fund. This would be the school building fund that the Tories scrapped when they got into Government, preventing other local schools from being brought into the present day!!!

Quoted from richard.garvie

The money for the new school came from the school building fund. This would be the school building fund that the Tories scrapped when they got into Government, preventing other local schools from being brought into the present day!!!

I know. But further irony came with the tories recent advertising wraparound on the Advertiser claiming that they were responsible for delivering this to Newbury! The gall is astonishing. To claim responsibility for a huge waste of money that the Labour party made available. You are all dicks.

Quoted from richard.garvie

The money for the new school came from the school building fund. This would be the school building fund that the Tories scrapped when they got into Government, preventing other local schools from being brought into the present day!!!

Most of the money came from the fund - but they added a fair amount gained from the sale of half their land for development.  When they were stopped from demolishing Luker there were concerns they would not raise enough to cover the cost of the new school. I wonder how the books are balancing now?

Quoted from 26

You are all dicks.

Delicately put.  

Quoted from massifheed

Delicately put.  

Sorry, but it's the truth. Such hypocrisy and duplicity.

That's if they are balancing...

Quoted from 26

Well they wasted £26m on a new school. So there you have education and overspend. But apparently WBC have nothing to do with either of these things. They just provide hot meals for little old ladies.

What would you have spent the money from the School Building Fund, earmarked for building new schools on?

It's never a wise course of action to get angry with things you don't understand, as you seem to have here.

What's this go to do with tuition fees anyway?

Quoted from user23.3

What would you have spent the money from the School Building Fund, earmarked for building new schools on?

I know the question was not aimed at me but I would have spent the School Buidling Fund money on a new school - and not padded it out with millions more that involved selling off playing fields. I worry that the school will end up in debt.

Quoted from user23.3

What would you have spent the money from the School Building Fund, earmarked for building new schools on?

Nothing. I saw and commented on here at the time that just because it came from a central government fund, it did not mean it was free money. St Barts didn't need rebuilding. Just because there is a pot, doesn't mean it has to be spent. That is a civil servant attitude,

Quoted from user23.3

What's this go to do with tuition fees anyway?

It's you that seems to have missed the fact that tuition fees pay for education. A public service.

Quoted from blackdog

I wonder how the books are balancing now?

I dsoubt the then head cares. He got a wing named after him. Not bad for a bloke that failed to bring the project in on time or in budget.

Quoted from 26

Nothing. I saw and commented on here at the time that just because it came from a central government fund, it did not mean it was free money. St Barts didn't need rebuilding. Just because there is a pot, doesn't mean it has to be spent. That is a civil servant attitude,

In what way are you qualified to judge that it didn't need rebuilding?

I would have thought it's not just civil servants that want to see our children taught in schools are are fit for purpose, many more people such as me do too. Surely there's no point protesting about how students can't afford the tuition fees if you're not going to send them to a learning environment that will enable those who wish to, to go to university?

Whats the point in a protest nobody knows about?
Of course turn out is going to be poor if nobody knows its happening.

3,000 were invited to attend on facebook, it was more of a social media event. The follow up protest is being publicised, and despite claiming in the press that he would meet students before the vote, Mr Benyon has once again did a U turn by saying his diary is full!!!

Quoted from richard.garvie

3,000 were invited to attend on facebook, it was more of a social media event. The follow up protest is being publicised, and despite claiming in the press that he would meet students before the vote, Mr Benyon has once again did a U turn by saying his diary is full!!!

So 2,950 thought that it was a waste of time turning up.

Really facebook is a lousy way of organizing any sort of activism.
The people who are the most enthusiastic activists are the exact same people who will have the sense to avoid using a privacy destroying data mine like fb. Myself included. Nobody will take you seriously if you make fb your base of operations. Fb type 'campaigns' are simply not taken seriously by anybody who matters and likely never will be.

If you want to do it properly. Take the time to organize a proper website (its neither hard, or expensive) and advertise it through more diverse means.

I know I would have been there and bought people with me, had I known it was happening. Just purely because mental health services are being hit by these same cuts and West Berks is closing some local services in relation to this.

The initial demo was organised by students who on the day, didn't even travel from their school because they couldn't get there in time. It's all very bizarre. I have now offerred to help organise the event on Wednesday because the issue is very personal to me, having not been able to stay on at school or go to University. I didn't stay on at school for academic reasons, but for the fact there was no support out there at the time.

There is actually a big protest planned for Thursday evening regarding the day centre closure, it is being organised by Unison. I'm not sure if there is a local branch website, but I believe they are expecting a fair number of people to take part. I'm actually away, but I would have loved to have been there. I just find it hard to believe that the Ormonde Centre is to be closed, despite the fact it will now mean some severly disabled people will never leave the house as there are no longer any facilities to cater for them. Over in Mortimer, some of the elderly users of the Day Centre there will no longer have a place to meet. Same in Compton. The facility at West Berks Community Hospital that caters for mental health, gone without any thought to where the users will go now.

Hillcroft which is a day center for people with mental health difficulties who are in crisis is being closed.
The only service in town that helps people with either acute conditions cope with rough patches. Without this more people are going to end up socially isolated and deteriorating to the point of requiring hospitalization, when they otherwise would have only needed a bit of minor support and social contact here and there to stay well. This ultimately is bad for the sufferers and will end up costing the NHS more in the long run.

Sure an 'alternative' plan is being pitched. Its currently a spec of a project to happen some time in the future when people agree what they want. It has already been stated it won't be funded by the council. They just think they can run the thing and have somebody else chalk up the change in a period nobody else has any money either. Which includes asking the people using the service to pay towards the costs from a 'personal budget' which how much people can spend will be decided by council workers with the CMHT. This 'personal budget' money will apparently be sourced from the council funds that are left from the same(?) pot that has already been diced up to the point of being unable to afford the current service.
Its as retarded as all the councils other hair brained schemes of recent memory.
The meeting I was in where this came up last, the council manager person didn't seem to think there is anything wrong with said plan, that to me sounds like they've taken day care and turned it into a funky new type of pyramid scheme.

Protest tomorrow is off, all members are now coming to support the Unison protest on Thursday hopefully. 6pm outside WBC in Market Street, Newbury.

Quoted from richard.garvie

Protest tomorrow is off, all members are now coming to support the Unison protest on Thursday hopefully. 6pm outside WBC in Market Street, Newbury.

So long as it's not too cold of course......

I've been in touch with Unison for details and will be attending on Thursday.
Emailed everybody I have contact details for who will be affected by the mental health related cuts, so hopefully will have a few people come along with me.

I really hope they get a good turnout. Word is the council meeting has been moved forward to avoid the councillors being shouted at by the protesters.

Oh the poor beleaguered councillors.
The gods forbid that something may happen to inconvenience them.

I do think that it's a bit of an overeaction for the council to move their meeting so that people can't tell them what they think. It will be interesting to see who votes against the motion that proposes that these decisions are delayed.

I guess the upshot is that if they've jumped to moving their meeting.
It means they either are or will be aware just how pissed people are.

The Lib Dem motion has given every elected member a way out on this. How many will support it?

Quoted from richard.garvie

The Lib Dem motion has given every elected member a way out on this. How many will support it?

You are presupposing that elected members decide how they vote - they will all do as they are told and vote along party lines as usual.  

Quoted from richard.garvie

Protest tomorrow is off, all members are now coming to support the Unison protest on Thursday hopefully. 6pm outside WBC in Market Street, Newbury.

Except you won't be there, will you Richard?